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HomeHomeOur CommunityOur CommunityGeneral Discuss...General Discuss...Newsletter Size and Email BlacklistNewsletter Size and Email Blacklist
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8/10/2008 9:21 PM
 

Hi,

I have around 9000 users on PokerDIY.com.  I want to send a Newsletter to all those who have opted in to the newsletter role, but the default is set to on (ie. a new users auto-signs up for the newsletter unless they change their prefs). Lets assume 8000 emails will be sent out. I don't have a double-confirmation system on PokerDIY (so you can enter fake email addresses to sign up). This means a percentage of users use fake emails and these will all bounce. Another percentage of users will Block as Spam. If too much of this occurs then my IP may be blacklisted.

 

So, my questions are:

At what size (num users) should I consider switching to a dedicated email service like iContact or ConstantContact (these 2 seem the best/cheapest for 9k) after my investigation). They use private IP addresses and have a number of tools to make sure your Newsletter is not considered spam by the major email clients.

I was going to use the email service sites to contstruct a good looking HTML newsletter and then paste it into the core Newsletter module and send it via my SMTP server on PokerDIY, but now I am considering going the whole hog and using their service to send as well.

The drawback of using a 3rd party service is that I have to export all the users (by Newsletter Role) and import then and then if they unsubscribe I have to reflect this on my site. And it is not free compared to using the core Newsletter mod.

Any advice from email marketeers? How many people is considered a large number and spam-worthy? Is it a risk sending it via my site to 9k of people?

Some links on Email policies:

http://www.clickz.com/showPage.html?page=3381621

http://www.zeromillion.com/webmarketing/blacklist-whitelist.html


Thanks,
Rodney
Smart-Thinker - Social Networking modules for DotNetNuke
The DotNetNuke Directory - Are you listed?
PokerDIY - Example Implementation of DNN Social Network
Do use DNN a lot? Try the DotNetNuke Toolbar to save you time!
 
New Post
8/11/2008 9:50 AM
 

Ok, another 10 hours on this and I have learnt a bit more about the process and thought I would share  ;)

Firstly, I narrowed down the 3rd party email services to

There may be others but after an extensive search these 4 were the best priced and most recommend for 9k of users. My other requirement is that I only send a newsletter every couple of months, which then ruled out the top 4 above as they are all monthly subs. CampaignMonitor is really cool and I spent the better half of a day using their free templates to design a newsletter which looks good (you can see it online on my poker blog). The reason I like them is that they have a great Web 2.0 website and they charge per email sent which suits my last requirement perfectly.

So... I prefected my newsletter template and started to import my users from PokerDIY (7142 have Opted-In). This is where the problem started - my SQL export keeps failing on characters in the email/name - I tried to use Unicode and exporting to Excel but it never works (gains more columns and the export fails). 

So now I am back at square one - I am looking at Newsletter Mailing modules for DNN. My biggest concern is still preserving my IP address which seesm to rely more on SPF records and SPAM filter conventions. I am using my template from CampaingMonitor so it should pass the spam tests and they have some good advice on how to configure the DNS for your domain to help prevent it being marked as JunkMail.

Although the core DNN module sent my Newsletter fine (although I had to hack the source and change the FCK Editor to show the "Basic -> Html" option as I could not paste it in otherwise (the formatting distored)) I would still like more control over reporting on what is clicked and bounce-reports etc. As usual, I find the core modules work to a certain point at which time a commerical module needs to be implemtented. From searching the forums and marketplaces I have narrowed it down to:

  1. DataSprings Opt-In
  2. DNN-Modules Advanced Emailer
  3. InteractiveWebs Bulk Emailer

The others are too similar to the core and not advanced enough. I have never had replies from the folk at DNN-Modules so I am wary of them (I analyzed the PortalStore a year ago with no replies to multiple requests). I have not had experience with DataSprings but this seems to be the most highly regarded judging from the forum comments:

http://www.dotnetnuke.com/Community/Forums/tabid/795/forumid/108/threadid/178123/scope/posts/Default.aspx

http://www.dotnetnuke.com/Community/Forums/tabid/795/forumid/118/threadid/188021/scope/posts/Default.aspx

http://www.dotnetnuke.com/Community/Forums/tabid/795/forumid/118/threadid/190842/scope/posts/Default.aspx

and I have not heard anything about Interactive Webs yet (doesn't mean they are bad!) but they are more expensive that DataSprings. According to the site hte module handles Link Tracking within the newsletter, Bounec handling (this is very important to prevent blacklisting in future!). Has anyone used this module before?

Expect some questions on SPF records and how best to make a SMTP server look less dodgy...

 

 

 


Entrepreneur

PokerDIY Tournament Manager - PokerDIY Tournament Manager<
PokerDIY Game Finder - Mobile Apps powered by DNN
PokerDIY - Connecting Poker Players

 
New Post
8/11/2008 10:09 PM
 

I see you found your old profile Rodney, 47 posts to 1470 in a single day...  Super Rodney!

We thought it may be helpful to share with you some details about our experience at InteractiveWebs.

We have been in your situation, and the reason we developed our Bulk Emailer module is to solve the exact problems you face now, but with a goal of sending 88,000 email messages and SMS messages every week from one website. The problems we faced took us over 2 years of tweaking and modifying to solve.

Some of the specific issues with bulk email from a DNN site includes.

1. Invalid data (bad email addresses)
2. Spam filters
3. Risk of being blacklisted
4. Bounce Back
5. Unsubscribe Management (important in Australia to meet legal requirements)

To solve these issues we developed a number of integrated strategies.

1.  We developed our module to handle invalid email addresses that are either imported into custom lists, or manually set into the database and reside on a DNN users account. The sending of an email against an account or list with invalid email addresses will not stop sends. This was a bit issue with other bulk email applications we tested both inside and outside DNN.

2. Spam filters are dependant on several things. 
Content - We found that templates are important, and our module can use html templates. But our best results are using MS word to mhtml. We found that a single page html page is really designed to be an email. Most spam servers allow this content through. Key word checking etc is always an issue. So don't push Viagra at users.

- Correct DNS and SMTP settings for your sites SMTP server. - Very important for reveres lookups, and is often over looked.
- How many email messages are sent at one time to the receiving smtp servers. - we put our system on a timer that sends 50 email messages per cycle. Slow the cycle in the scheduler settings to ensure that the messages are dripped out at a good rate.

3. This is based on a number of things. a few of the important things are.

- with AOL type services. How many people click on marking you as a spam email in a set period. - This is why a robust opt out system that knows the email address that the email was sent to is important. If someone opts out of communication with our system, it is easy and will work, even if the email address is imported into a separate send list. (there is an override option too for emergency communication)

- Slowing the cycle to mail servers like AOL is important for this too. See the above.

- Using tokens for making email messages unique in content. "Dear John" etc. We have tokens for any profile data item you create.

- Ensuring that your html template does not reference images on spam listed sites - our MHTML system makes this easy.

4. Bounce Management - because a large number of email addresses can be invalid. Bounce management can reduce the load on your SMTP server by not sending to email addresses that are known to bounce. We have this built in our latest version.

5. Unsubscribe - Mentioned above. but also important in Australia and many other countries that you meet your legal requirements. This does, and has a management system for it too.

Bulk Emailer

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

We are releaseing a trial version this week. Please check it out.

 
New Post
8/11/2008 11:05 PM
 

Hello David,

 

Thanks for the detailed reply - I have sent you an email (to support and david.finley@inter... (there does not seem to be any contact info on your website) - let me know if you have not got it please.  *Edit - I found the Contact Us tab - it is not shown when viewing certain tabs (like the Bulk Emailer Product Page ;)

2 accounts - yes, I can't post with this account, only reply! Been like this for almost a year and the core fix does not work...

 


Entrepreneur

PokerDIY Tournament Manager - PokerDIY Tournament Manager<
PokerDIY Game Finder - Mobile Apps powered by DNN
PokerDIY - Connecting Poker Players

 
New Post
8/11/2008 11:20 PM
 

I have similar needs and questions, and would be interested in a comparison between Bulk Email and Onyak's Nuke


pmgerholdt
 
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HomeHomeOur CommunityOur CommunityGeneral Discuss...General Discuss...Newsletter Size and Email BlacklistNewsletter Size and Email Blacklist


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