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HomeHomeOur CommunityOur CommunityGeneral Discuss...General Discuss...Why is DotNetNuke giving itself a black eyeWhy is DotNetNuke giving itself a black eye
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8/16/2008 2:31 PM
 

ROBAX is dead on. 

Put another way (maybe a little more politically correct - grin)  ALL people are good at some things and not so good at others.  A person good at developing wouldn't be my first choice for a communications, PR, marketing position as generally these types of people aren't very good in those areas. Although I was pretty impressed with Shaun's preface (Or chapter one - can't remember) in his (and others) DNN book. The condition of the DNN website - as Andrew and others talk about is a function of this. Another function of the lack of marketing abilities would be the sponsor packages.  Another would be the MarketPlace - while functional it isn't even close to it's marketing potential.  Another would be the forums layout and content.  A VERY good example would have been the remember me function of the website - it is finally fixed - Whoohoo!! - but community members complained about it for ever!  Much like they are complaining about the forum notifications now.

Sebastian is right - the communications position or team would not be an easy task.  This position/team would have to be privy to and updated on all things corp, core, and project. And they would have to monitor and take part in the forums on a very consistent basis.  And it wouldn't hurt if they had up-to-date knowledge of third party things either. BTW, I just learned that the core team is not part of the corp - I had always thought the other way around.

With regards to the use of core modules only on DNN.com.  I understand the desire to use core modules on the site but I think that most of the reasons for this are outdated.  I like and use many of the core modules but I think that core modules are less important now that DNN has grown to what it is and has been able to attract many third party developers to the project. Are the third party developers not a part of and very important to the community too?  As much as I really hate to say it - because I appreciate all the very hard work Crispy put into the core forums module - if you look at any of the other higher traffic DNN sites - they are not using the core forums module.  And being that DNN.com is the highest traffic DNN site...........  Since I am a "marketing guy" I can see many advantages to using third party modules on the mother ship.

 

 
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8/17/2008 10:38 AM
 

Even with your origanal post you did contribute. You have mentally put yourself in the role to complain and got carried away. Every one knows that there is a few small problems they don't constantly need to be remembered. Every web page that on the web got small problem with browser compatabilities. So see the FireFox compliant as a ability one browser got over another for any CSS compatibilty issues don't complain on this forum complain to the browser developers forum and tell us you complained to them, I promise you will get support from our community. Yes, not all problems is third party but let me tell you this DNN corp is one (if not the only) of the few that tries to keep up with technology and I feel they do a great job at it as well. I bet if you have to pay for all the things you complain about to fix, you will rather live with it then to complain about them. I want you to know i also got a few issues but I don't complain I am looking for solutions and give recomendations. So just remember just because you can complain does not give you the right to do so! I hope you can take critisism as good as you can give it. Take one problem at a time lets help you solve it don't just sit there and compile an archive. I challange you to wait for then next release of DNN and check if some of the stuff you complained is solved. If there is a few solved than you stop complaining if not you can complain as much as you like to and I will pull back my post about your complaints. So are we on !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 
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8/17/2008 12:31 PM
 

cathal connolly wrote

 Andrew Hawes wrote
 

- Hire people: To me DNN now has enough of a following and reputation that it should able to apply some business model which would allow it to take on enough top noch staff to meet or exceed expectations. This can be done while still keeping with community driven open source standards. At least that's what I think should be possible.

- Make excellence a priority without excuses. I know what people are thinking "If DNN focuses on fixing every little bug and keeping the site updated there won't be time for any new features or innovation". Your right, unless you add more of the right people to the project and have people to mamange and organize the work. That brings be back to my first point. Hire people - Incentivise volunteers.

Thanks for listening.

 

Andrew,

I agree with you, but theres a simple flaw here - to hire people you have to have money, a commodity that dotnetnuke doesn't have much of at present.

Cathal

There is no flaw. I said "To me DNN now has enough of a following and reputation that it should able to apply some business model which would allow it to take on enough top noch staff to meet or exceed expectations." If DNN does not have enough resources to do what is needed then no project of this kind can ever succeed. DNN should pack it up. I don't believe it is true. I belive that the model needs to change while keeping the elements that made it so popular and usefull.

 
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8/17/2008 12:57 PM
 

Jeff Cochran wrote

 Andrew Hawes wrote
 

What I don't see is who the community should be holding responsible.

 

If the community of a community project has an issue, they have to hold the community responsible.  That includes the core team, module teams and posters in the forums.  At the very least, if anyone spots what they believe to be a reproducible bug, it should be their responsibility to log it into Gemini.

I completely disagree. What you are saying equates to "NO ONE IS RESPONSIBLE". That does not mean that community members can't share in the responsibility and take some of the load. In fact that is how the community will grow. But there must be some person or group who says "The Buck Stops Here". That's leadership.

Jeff Cochran wrote

 Andrew Hawes wrote

The DNN website should represent the best that DNN can offer not just in an application, but in content and community. This is what most people naturally expect. People are looking and there are more and more reasons not to be impressed.

I'll play devil's advocate and ask why?  Or at least why does it have to have everything?  For example, Joomla, possibly the largest competitor to DNN, has what I'd call a failry modern and up to date site.  But they don't have demo videos, instead they link to sites running Joomla.  Umbraco, another excellent site, doesn't contain most of what the DNN site does.

Sure the devil is always telling us "Mediocrity is good enough for everyone else why isn't good enough for you". That's just not the kind of thinking that leads to success.

As a side note I just I just started a project that had to use Joomla. So far I have been really impressed by the Joomla website and related sites like RocketTemplates. As I look under the hood however I see much that leaves me wishing for DNN and its functionality. But I tell you Joomla sells me much more on first impression. Given one look at each website I can't imagine most people choosing DNN over Joomla. That is a shame, becuase I believe DNN has much more to offer. And to be fair it is not just the DNN core and projects that give a bad impressions many module deveopers are doing a horible job of living up to DNN. There are some exceptions that are doing great also.

 

 
New Post
8/17/2008 1:09 PM
 

Joe Brinkman wrote

 Jeff Cochran wrote
 

... it is very outdated, the Blue skin has been around for years.  It's oh so last week in web terms.

 

[comments removed for space]

Oh and to answer Jeff's comment more directly -

DotNetNuke 4.9.0 MinimalExtropy Skin

Joe, I hope you are kidding. Even in this small and presumably not fully representative screen shot I can see little improvement from the "Blue Skin". Come on, skins and templates for DNN and other systems have gone so much further. I would hope DNN could do better than that. This again gets to the point.

Even if it's free you should sell DNN. Push it like you want need people to buy it.

 
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