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HomeHomeOur CommunityOur CommunityGeneral Discuss...General Discuss...To Joomla! or not to Joomla!:  DNN is the questionTo Joomla! or not to Joomla!: DNN is the question
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6/2/2007 11:01 PM
 

WOW, thanks Nina for an excellent post. Lot's of good first hand info there.

I looked at Joomla about a year and a half ago before I started using DNN. I was unable to find any forms/database application type modules for it like Xmod or Listx.  I might have to take another look but I doubt they will have anything as good as DNN.

With regards to the Xmod vs. Listx question and the comment about spending "big" dollars buying third party modules I would say this. Both Xmod and Listx are very good products. There are two main differences in my opinion - Listx is more powerful but is very VERY difficult for a non-programmer to use. A non-programmer can do alot of things with Xmod due mainly to the great help files, documentation, and support. That said, you will find that you can build many of the modules you have listed with Xmod and save yourself some money. The issue is whether you want to spend the time doing it yourself vs. spending $30 - $50 for a thrid party module. I've learned that if there is a third party module that does exactly what I want to do it is better to spend the money than the time. Of course someone who has more experience with JS, CSS, html, etc. could probably do it much quicker! (grin)

Greg

 
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6/2/2007 11:39 PM
 

nina wrote

Dang.. that was one hour of my time ... but your questions were worth the thought!!

 

Thanks, Nina!  If you are every in the DC area, adult beverages on me!  :)  I had a lengthy follow-up, but my fingers slipped on the laptop and all was lost when IE went backwards...too angry and tired to retype now, but will in the morning...taking the night off from DNN for a change. 

 

 
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6/3/2007 5:37 PM
 

If you have to learn .Net or PHP, I'd take the time to learn .Net.  Most companies use either Java and/or .Net as thier primary development languages in-house and PHP/Pearl is usually 3rd on the list and most companies cannot afford to support 3 different development languages.  For example, where I work we had all 3 at one time and then it was decide that the Pearl programmer would become part of the Java team and be trained in Java.  To say the least, none of the Perl programmers are there now. 

Then the question become, learn Java or .Net.   From most forums I have read, including comments from die-hard Java programmers who checked out .Net after Nealy's "Open-Source is killing Java" comments, hands down .Net is far easier to learn than Java.  One Java programmer said ".Net is J2EE doen right, and whole lot easier for programmers to learn".

 
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6/3/2007 7:22 PM
 

I found this thread to be very interesting. I especially appreciate Nina's post as it is the most objective comparison I have ever read on these 2 products. It is especially useful because it does great job of describing the issues from a non-developer perspective.

The only question I have is in regards to the comment which was raised earlier in the thread by John Mitchell. He mentioned that Joomla! is a more mature patform than DNN, even though it is newer. I have done quite a bit of research on this subject in the past and therefore I am scratching my head a bit.

Joomla! began its life as a different open source project named Mambo. It was released in 2001 under a GPL open source license. In 2005, members of the development team defected, forked the code base, and named the new project Joomla!.

DotNetNuke began its life as a product named IBuySpy Workshop. It was released Dec 24, 2002 under a BSD open source license. In 2003 it was renamed to DotNetNuke and has been evolving ever since.

So basically Joomla! is 2 years older than DotNetNuke in terms of its product life. So if maturity is measured primarily by age, then I guess I would have to agree. However, the maturity comment in the earlier post was not based on age. It actually appeared to be based on some other criteria.

If we look at download statistics, we can see the metrics for Joomla! here ( http://joomlacode.org/gf/project/joomla/frs/ ). Aside from the fact that I do not understand why there are 30+ files in the release package, if we focus on the Full Package, we can conclude that there were 186,021 downloads since Dec 23, 2006.

Coincidentally, DotNetNuke had a release on Dec 24, 2006 ( 4.4.0 ) and if we go to SourceForge, we can review our download metrics in comparison. To be fait in the comparison, lets just choose one of our 4 release package formats - the Install package. If we add up all the downloads for this package it totals ~ 140,000.

So there does seem to be a little bit more download activity on the Joomla! project. But does this indicate maturity?

If we look at marketing impact, this is where we see a substantial difference between projects. Joomla! has been extremely active in their marketing activities since the project fork was created ( fork events often create an explosion in press releases, etc... ). As a result if you look at Google Trends, Alexa, or other marketing-based systems, you will see Joomla! ranked much higher than DNN. But does marketing indicate maturity?

Lastly, there was a comment about the availability of free add-ons in Joomla!. This is an interesting comment because I think we all know that free does not always mean great value. Free add-ons typically come with no warranty or support, so although the initial price is attractive, the long term cost may be high. Compare this to the DNN ecosystem where there are a lot of high quality commercial add-ons. Because money has changed hands, there is an expectation for ongoing support which is typically a better long term business investment. So does the quantity of free add-ons indicate maturity?

I guess my point is that maturity is a subjective term which is often used without any context or criteria. And I don't think it would help much if I expressed my own opinion on whether DotNetNuke is a mature system or not, as I am more than a little biassed :).

 


My comments are my own and are offered WITHOUT PREJUDICE

Shaun Walker
http://www.siliqon.com
 
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6/3/2007 7:32 PM
 

Shawn,

With all due respect, the last I looked Joomla is written in PHP - not Java. Also, PHP is not Pearl, the are two seperate languages, so your argument is off base in this thread.

One of the original questions was:  Which is easiest to learn--.php or asp.net?

Are you suggesting that ASP.Net (which can be any .Net language) is easier to learn than PHP?

I do agree with your point though if you are a new developer wanting to get into the development job market. 
I just didn't read that as being the case in the original post.

Some else said that Joomla doesn't have Forms add-ons.  Not that I am really trying to present a case for Joomla, but that just isn't true.  There are multiple very mature Forms applications for Joomla.
Here is a short list:
http://extensions.joomla.org/component/option,com_mtree/task,listcats/cat_id,1828/Itemid,35/

As an avid DotNetNuke developer and user, I say lets not put blinders on when it comes to the other applications out there.
Lets use their strengths as incintive to do better.


DotNetNuke Modules from Snapsis.com
 
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