Products

Solutions

Resources

Partners

Community

Blog

About

QA

Ideas Test

New Community Website

Ordinarily, you'd be at the right spot, but we've recently launched a brand new community website... For the community, by the community.

Yay... Take Me to the Community!

Welcome to the DNN Community Forums, your preferred source of online community support for all things related to DNN.
In order to participate you must be a registered DNNizen

HomeHomeOur CommunityOur CommunityGeneral Discuss...General Discuss...Opinion: DotNetNuke and ASPDNSF ML/DNNOpinion: DotNetNuke and ASPDNSF ML/DNN
Previous
 
Next
New Post
2/9/2009 8:03 AM
 

Status Update

I have received several queries on the ASPDNSF status through our Interzoic website.  I think this forum thread is the best venue to reply.


Production Server - runtime ASPDNSF server errors
My development team put extra unscheduled weeks into getting ASPDNSF running (including a full reinstall).  The client delayed launch of their site.  We finally launched the site with some known glitches.  After launch we started getting server ASPDNSF server errors and had to roll back the site to recover. 

We have provided a full backup of the production portal to ASPDNSF for sebugging.  George provided two DLLs to fix the server errors, but now the shopping basket gets emptied every time you go to check out.  After all the delays and extra work we've had to simply to put up a "technical difficulties - please call in your order" sign on our ecommerce section.

George has seen these problems before and has "some ideas" about what is causing this but no fix has been forthcoming.


Staging Server - DNN upgrade ASPDNSF server errors
We took a clone of production, removed all of the "consequential" third party modules and still could not upgrade from 4.9.0 to 4.9.1 - we get ASPDNSF server errors.  We then "uninstalled" ASPDNSF and were able to upgrade to 4.9.1 without any problem.  So the problem is clearly due to ASPDNSF.

In case you don't know, if you want to uninstall ASPDNSF software, then you have to manually remove all the SQL tables, back out edits to web.config and FriendlyURL records, etc. I can only think this reflects a deep and pervasive disregard for progressional programming protocal and hygeine.  In keeping with their abysmal documentation, this "feature" is not only glossed over it is entirely omitted.  You'll have to search their forums for details.

We have provided a full backup of the stripped down staging portal to ASPDNSF for debugging and hopeful they can get their product to allow DNN upgrades.

George tells me he has found and fixed several bugs but still cannot upgrade.  So the search continues.  He also told me his team was working to provide a clean uninstall.

Conclusion
ASPDNSF does not seem to have the will or resources to provide a solid DNN product at this time.  Like many others I keep hoping that they can (soon) provide an Enterprise class eCommerce solution because the DNN community really needs one.

I very much appreciate the care and attention George is putting into our issues.  I've had cordial emails from one of the chief officers at ASPDNSF.  As much as I willing to work with and support ASPDNSF I also feel a community responsibility to have a frank discussion about my ongoing experience.  For some reason ASPDNSFchose to ship (and charge good money) for a beta product.  This has caused a lot of heart ache.  This was their decision and then need to stand up and take responsibility for it.

I have no way to estimate how close ASPDNSF is to providing a stable product.  I thought they might be close but now I'm not so certain.  I'll keep you posted.

George - please feel free to comment, correct or update as you please.

Waiting for the calvary in Boise...
Chris

 




Chris Wylie
Chief Executive Officer
www.AccordLMS.com
1775 W. State Street Suite 371, Boise ID 83702 USA
 
 
New Post
2/11/2009 12:36 PM
 

Chris - Thanks for the update!



Andrew Walker

Learn to make your own beer and wine at homeIf you enjoy making your own beer and/or wine - be sure to check out http://www.ForemostBrewing.com
 
New Post
2/14/2009 5:27 PM
 

Status Update: Bad to Worse

 

Production Server - runtime ASPDNSF server errors
[ISSUE 1] - I’m not certain what happened to George’s “ideas” but no new dll’s were released this past week. Production performance degraded. After presenting ASPDNSF server errors 4 times on one day our client decided to uninstall (and lose their product catalog for a second time) in order to stabilize the site. We had to manually uninstall all the SQL tables, etc as described above. The site has since run fine without any problems.

Staging Server #1 - DNN upgrade ASPDNSF server errors
[ISSUE 2] - ASPDNSF has not put any resources into figuring out why Staging #1 is not able to upgrade to 4.9.1. They have a full backup of this site in house and have duplicated the error in house.
[ISSUE 3] - ASPDNSF has not revealed to me any progress on cleaning up their product during an uninstall.

Staging Server #2 - runtime ASPDNSF server errors
[ISSUE 1 – same as Production] – we created an exact copy of production (before we uninstalled ASPDNSF) and created a new staging server for ASPDNSF to debug. When we initially tried to bring the site up we encountered the same ASPDNSF server errors. Then the site stabilized and we have not seen the errors since.

Core Member Comments
At ASPDNSF’s request, a DNN core member shared with me his perspectives:
- DNN Marketplace is running ASPDNSF ML not ASPDNSF ML/DNN. [You have to wonder why DNN corp. made the decision not to run the DNN version]
- “ASPDNSF has been very responsive to problems in the ASPDNSF ML/DNN product”. [Maybe it helps to be a DNN core member]
- He was able to get a half dozen ASPDNSF ML/DNN sites running, with the caveat “we always promote the use of the source code version of ASPDNSF, when we have encountered a bug, we have fixed the code”.

ASPDNSF Comments
[ISSUE 4] – “In my opinion, we have already been showing a lot of good faith in addressing pretty much everything you have reported, but some of these are not overnight one-line-fix type issues. To give you an idea, right now, there are items simply disappearing from the HTTP context, completely outside of our software mind you, which we are trying to track down within the DNN (and .NET) framework itself.”  [I'm not certain they really wanted to share with me this issue]

Current Status
Starting on Monday of this past week on a daily basis I asked for status updates and what resources ASPDNSF was dedicating to these issues, etc. Finally, on Friday afternoon, George communicated to me that he had spent a several hours on Staging Server #2 [ISSUE 1] but was not able to product the ASPDNSF server errors. George feels that our team now needs to demonstrate a repeatable server error for him to put any more work into debugging this.

I replied by email and left a phone message, what about the upgrade problem - [ISSUE 2]? Maybe if he could find out why ASPDNSF was causing server errors during upgrade, it might shed some light on why we’re getting occasions ASPDNSF server errors on production. All the ASPDNSF server errors are the same (as documented earlier in this thread). I did not get any reply.

Conclusion
A week has gone by. From all that I can estimate, ASPDNSF only spent some R&D on [ISSUE 1] on Friday and has knocked the ball back in our court “make it repeatedly fail before I spend more time on this”. Apparently ASPDNSF did not spend any time over the last week on [ISSUE 2, 3 and 4] even though #2 is repeatable, #3 is just basic hygiene and who knows the dark depths of [ISSUE 4]?

The launch of our client’s website was delayed two weeks due to all the last minute ASPDNSF triage. The site has been launched for two weeks and ASPDNSF has had to be uninstalled. Now we’re 4 weeks late in the project "completion" and our check fis being withheld until ASPDNSF is working.

People continue to contact me directly and share similar experiences. Some say they are under contract and cannot speak out publicly, others say they personally like the guys at ASPDNSF and don’t want to speak out against them, others are afraid that if they speak their mind that the level of ASPDNSF will get even worse. I have this fear also, but I do feel that it is a community responsibility to share a full and frank disclosure of my experience. ASPDNSF has accused me of lambasting them. Believe me, even though my client is pissed (the site was late, their eCommerce is not working, they paid a lot for media announcements for the eCommerce launch, their is no end in sight, etc) and I’m getting into a cash flow bind, I am trying to reign in my emotions and keep this factual. I really want ASPDNSF to work and succeed. DNN needs an enterprise eCommerce solution. This is important to our entire ecosystem.  However ASPDNSF does not seem to care.

Due to the lack luster communications from ASPDNSF and the apparent lack of motivation to focus their resources on the various issues I’ve identified and no real assurance that ASPDNSF is going to be more motivated in the week ahead – I’m pretty discouraged.

Let’s hope next week is better. I’ll keep you posted.

In the meantime, I encourage other people to share their experiences. ASPDNSF has told me that my “individual circumstances are a bit extenuating”. Is this true?

George - please feel free to comment, correct or update as you please.

Waiting for the calvary in Boise...
Chris




Chris Wylie
Chief Executive Officer
www.AccordLMS.com
1775 W. State Street Suite 371, Boise ID 83702 USA
 
 
New Post
2/15/2009 5:30 PM
 

 

Chris,
What are your errors? I have had ASPDNSF for two years, including product support and source license agreement. I have turned down at least 20 DNN & ASPDNSF projects until I am comfortable with something that is sort of stable.
On Friday, I got hold of the ML/DNN 7.2.1 vb source and just had a marathon session including real time debugging. ASPDNSF is a true hodgepodge of effort and code, and slowly but surely I am beginning to see the light.
IMO, the single most problem with ASPDNSF code is that it needs to be refactored. Not just for ML/DNN but for real world use. Just because a DAL exists in a module or a project does not mean that it is designed properly. The code contains all sorts of scattered UIL (user interface) mixed with BLL business logic) and DAL (data access) including interlaced and hard coded SQL string builders. It is no wonder that the documentation says
<quote>WARNING: You can easily define a pricing/level/extended pricing/quantity pricing/coupon scheme that NO ONE could possibly figure out how the actual pricing was computed. Our suggestion is to KEEP IT SIMPLE. If you use Discount Percents for levels, DON'T USE extended pricing, and TURN OFF coupons for the level, etc... If you want to define extended pricing for each product variant, then set ALL level discounts to 0, disallow coupons, etc... NetStore will ALWAYS compute A price for each product and the entire order, but YOU may not be able to explain how the price was arrived at to your customers. KEEP IT SIMPLE!</quote>
In other words, "we are not sure what is going to happen either."
Having said that, ASPDNSF seems to work once you understand their concepts and their terms. It took me three weeks to figure out how to uninstall and reinstall ASPDNSF, and I now I use scripting and a template to install DNN & ASPDNSF in a single shot.Once I figured out the simple XML import system, I had it uploading thousands of SKUs at a time, updating existing related data. I even have a script to clean up my database mess without starting from scratch.
For example, here's a bleeding edge LinqToSQL code snippet that builds an xml file from a live system for direct import into ASPDNSF:
Sub GetProducts()
  Dim sd As New BaldwinDataContext
  Dim products = <AspDotNetStorefrontImportFile>
  <%= From p In sd.Products Take 1000 _
  Order By p.SKU _
  Select <Product>
  <Name><%= p.Name %></Name>
  <ProductTypeRef>Generic Product</ProductTypeRef>
  <ManufacturerPartNumber><%= p.ManufacturerNo %></ManufacturerPartNumber>
  <ManufacturerRef><%= p.Supplier %></ManufacturerRef>
  <Description><%= p.Description %></Description>
  <SKU><%= p.SKU %></SKU>
  <ProductVariant>
  <Name><%= p.Name %></Name>
  <Price><%= p.Price %></Price>
  <IsDefault>True</IsDefault>
  </ProductVariant>
  </Product> %>
  </AspDotNetStorefrontImportFile>
MakeFile("products.xml", products)
 
Yes, that is normal Visual Basic code running in Visual Studio 2008.
 
The most serious problem with the current version of ASPDNSF and DNN is requiring portal 0. This means that you cannot use any other portal, which is a serious downfall. If you have a working DNN site with multiple portals, forget about adding ASPDNSF (although I almost have it working on other portals properly).
 
One thing I have learned is to open your site in three tabs, DNN admin, ASPDNSF admin, and DNN event viewer and open a system event viewer. Then, when something you do causes a problem, you have a way to find out why. The other thing is that when ASPDNSF behaves funny, stop immediately and find the cause.  Otherwise, you will spend far too much time trying to remember how many things are broken. It is far too easy to compound issues and make it far more complicated than it really is.
I usually check the DNN event viewer first. Then I check the system event viewer for deeper problems.
90% of the problems I have experienced are due to an impedance mismatch between ASPDNSF and DNN paths.
Many simple App Config settings will break the admin site and make it unusable. A simple workaround for a development or staging site is to simple put the file exactly where ASPDNSF wants it. It's not pretty, but it will get you working again.
Be very careful switcvhing between dev/staging/production servers. Not only is it confusing, but a single mistake (think web.config) can make ASPDNSF crash your site and make all your portals unusable. Do not fool around with ASPDNSF on a production server just yet.
Other issues are often caused by the overly complex business rules. Ultimately I discovered I had used CAN instead of CAD for Canadian currency which did not work at all. Then I found a few more bugs in the continue checkout process. This morning, I placed my first test order from the site and it actually worked.
I really think that the ASPDNSF team has done a great job for beta release, but the product is still not ready for prime time. One thing that would really make a difference is to be able to export and import data including app configs as xml.  I am working on a module that does that right now so I can send an xml file to support to try on an empty vanilla site to demonstrate the issues,
Back to your situation, there are simple workarounds that will get you online for the time being without the repetitive uninstall and reinstall routine. Feel free to leave me a message if you want more ideas about your specific errors/problems.
Let’s keep our fingers crossed.

Dwayne J. Baldwin
 
New Post
2/16/2009 2:13 AM
 

Hi Dwayne,

Thanks for sharing your experience and concern for our situation.

We get the same error - AspDotNetStorefrontDNNComponents.AspdnsfPortalSettings..cctor() - although the offsets, such as +37, can be different.  The full error is posted below.

On Production (before we deleted ASPDNSF) we were getting the error randomly (a few times a day) and during dll updates to /bin or web.config updates (high frequency).  Currently on Staging #2 (a recent clone of Production) the error is no longer presenting. 

On Staging #1 (a version of Production stripped of most 3rd party modules) we get this error consistently when ever we try to upgrade from 4.9.0 to 4.9.1.  ASPDNSF support has a complete copy of this portal and can reproduce the problem but have not put any resources into finding the problem over the last two weeks (at least as far as I can tell due to their lack of communications).

The ASPDNSF developer who did the DNN version left ASPDNSF months ago and DNN support has languished ever since.  Maybe there is not enough revenue from the DNN version to warrant taking proper care of it.

Any ideas or suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Chris

 

Server Error in '/' Application.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Object reference not set to an instance of an object.
Description: An unhandled exception occurred during the execution of the current web request. Please review the stack trace for more information about the error and where it originated in the code.

Exception Details: System.NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object.

Source Error:

An unhandled exception was generated during the execution of the current web request. Information regarding the origin and location of the exception can be identified using the exception stack trace below.
 
Stack Trace:

[NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object.]
   AspDotNetStorefrontDNNComponents.AspdnsfPortalSettings..cctor() +37
 
[TypeInitializationException: The type initializer for 'AspDotNetStorefrontDNNComponents.AspdnsfPortalSettings' threw an exception.]
   AspDotNetStorefront.HttpModules.InitializerModule.HandleAuthenticateRequest(Object sender, EventArgs e) +229
   System.Web.SyncEventExecutionStep.System.Web.HttpApplication.IExecutionStep.Execute() +92
   System.Web.HttpApplication.ExecuteStep(IExecutionStep step, Boolean& completedSynchronously) +64
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Version Information: Microsoft .NET Framework Version:2.0.50727.1433; ASP.NET Version:2.0.50727.1433




Chris Wylie
Chief Executive Officer
www.AccordLMS.com
1775 W. State Street Suite 371, Boise ID 83702 USA
 
 
Previous
 
Next
HomeHomeOur CommunityOur CommunityGeneral Discuss...General Discuss...Opinion: DotNetNuke and ASPDNSF ML/DNNOpinion: DotNetNuke and ASPDNSF ML/DNN


These Forums are dedicated to discussion of DNN Platform and Evoq Solutions.

For the benefit of the community and to protect the integrity of the ecosystem, please observe the following posting guidelines:

  1. No Advertising. This includes promotion of commercial and non-commercial products or services which are not directly related to DNN.
  2. No vendor trolling / poaching. If someone posts about a vendor issue, allow the vendor or other customers to respond. Any post that looks like trolling / poaching will be removed.
  3. Discussion or promotion of DNN Platform product releases under a different brand name are strictly prohibited.
  4. No Flaming or Trolling.
  5. No Profanity, Racism, or Prejudice.
  6. Site Moderators have the final word on approving / removing a thread or post or comment.
  7. English language posting only, please.
What is Liquid Content?
Find Out
What is Liquid Content?
Find Out
What is Liquid Content?
Find Out